John Cena talk (split)

[Shaun2J 127]

Why are we arguing anyway? Bad guy, good guy... Cena cheated on his wife, by all means he's a heel. It's what we all wanted.

[Guest Ciaran The King]

But is Cena not a heel is a sort of way

[etz 78]

Maybe they just fancy a f*ck? You look too far into things "People cant control their behaviour!" its so dramatic. Maybe they choose to f*ck somebody because they want to...

 

That's actually worse because then they're actively choosing to be disloyal and immoral.

[Omega 354]

That's actually worse because then they're actively choosing to be disloyal and immoral.

 

Really, the most pretentious opinion I think I've ever heard. I know you love to wallow in the dsytopian view you have of the world and humantiy but f*cking really? Disloyal you can argue about but Immoral?

 

If Cena found that actually Brie Bella is his soul mate and that marrying his old high school sweetheart simply wasn't the right thing he then has to do nothing about it until he divorces his wife first? Please open the door reality is outside and would like you to recognise it.

 

Plus we're all debating how good or bad Cena is based on the moral assertions of a man who openly admitted to using prostitutes to get himself off.

[Guest The Beltster]

People choose to do various things that might not be the nicest thing in the world to do every day, doesnt make them a bad person in the same way that a life long rapist and pedo donating £500 to charity doesnt all of a sudden make him a good person.

[etz 78]

Really, the most pretentious opinion I think I've ever heard. I know you love to wallow in the dsytopian view you have of the world and humantiy but f*cking really? Disloyal you can argue about but Immoral?

 

Yes, immoral. Everyone regards betrayal of trust as immoral. Every culture and every religion, even non-religions like humanism. The only crime consistently regarded as worse for most of human history is murder, and even that was regarded as a lesser crime in some cultures. Oathbreakers lack honor and should be ashamed. What is a man worth, if his word is worthless?

 

And yes, I have put my money where my mouth is, repeatedly, and to my own detriment. No one said it was easy.

 

If Cena found that actually Brie Bella is his soul mate and that marrying his old high school sweetheart simply wasn't the right thing he then has to do nothing about it until he divorces his wife first? Please open the door reality is outside and would like you to recognize it.

 

1) Soul mates are a bullshit fairytale construct, just like the knight sweeping the girl off her feet. However, somewhat ironically, the likelyhood of divorce and infidelity are both higher in people who believe that shit but...

 

2) I also never said anything about divorce. I'm fine with it if he went to his wife and told her when he realized he wasn't in love with her anymore and was developing feelings for someone else.

 

3) I recognize reality, but I'm a human being with impulse control, not a ****ing animal. Just because you want to do something, doesn't mean you have to.

 

Plus we're all debating how good or bad Cena is based on the moral assertions of a man who openly admitted to using prostitutes to get himself off.

 

Relevance? Unless either party is married, I fail to see the betrayal in that.

 

People choose to do various things that might not be the nicest thing in the world to do every day, doesnt make them a bad person in the same way that a life long rapist and pedo donating £500 to charity doesnt all of a sudden make him a good person.

 

Say that right. Choosing to do bad things every day doesn't make you as bad as a life long rapist and pedo, but it's still choosing to do bad things. Bad people may choose to do bad things and good things, and good people do the same.

 

Effectively, my message to Cena would be "I am disappoint, son" whereas my message to Mira Hindley and her ilk would be "I hope you die slow and painful, monster."

Edited October 5, 2013 by etz

[Omega 354]

Yes, immoral. Everyone regards betrayal of trust as immoral. Every culture and every religion, even non-religions like humanism. The only crime consistently regarded as worse for most of human history is murder, and even that was regarded as a lesser crime in some cultures. Oathbreakers lack honor and should be ashamed. What is a man worth, if his word is worthless?

 

A normal human being? Fallible? Capable of making poor decision? Marrying people because it seemed right at the time? Immoral has nothing to do with it, except to the person who's trust is broken. To suggest that people who cheat on their spouses before leaving them are being immoral is recklessly misguided. Like people leave their partners after having a nice chat with someone on the off chance they are going maybe fall deeper in love with them at some point in the future. The act of leaving them is the breaking of the trust not whether or not they've slept with someone else.

 

And yes, I have put my money where my mouth is, repeatedly, and to my own detriment. No one said it was easy.

 

So, you'd stay with someone you realised was not the person you wanted to be with because you'd previously told them you'd be with them forever, without any idea that there might actually be a better option out there? Buck up...

 

1) Soul mates are a bullshit fairytale construct, just like the knight sweeping the girl off her feet. However, somewhat ironically, the likelyhood of divorce and infidelity are both higher in people who believe that shit but...

 

2) I also never said anything about divorce. I'm fine with it if he went to his wife and told her when he realized he wasn't in love with her anymore and was developing feelings for someone else.

 

3) I recognize reality, but I'm a human being with impulse control, not a ****ing animal. Just because you want to do something, doesn't mean you have to.

 

1. You have the empirical evidence that people who believe there are soulmates are more likely to cheat. Stop justifying your own nihilism with pretend facts.

 

2. Again, in the real world you don't leave your partner if you've started to have feelings for someone else,. If that was the case every marriage would end in divorce because temptation of one sort or another occurs for everyone. It's as ridiculous to suggest that someone who finds themselves falling in love with someone else that before any physical connection can be made they must leave their other partner as it is to suggest a woman should stay with a man who beats her because she promised to never leave him for better or worse. In the most base comparison do you go and buy a new car without even sitting in it?

 

3. So you have never, not even once done something, done something because you wanted to? Yeah, pretty sure the newspaper is on your windows and the tinfoil on the door.

 

Relevance? Unless either party is married, I fail to see the betrayal in that.

 

Sweet, so paying someone to do something they may well not want to with someone they almost certainly do want to so it to is great and totally moral but leaving someone you don't love is the worst thing this side of murder? It's so good to know that all prostitutes are living their dream by having endless sex with strangers for money with a happy smile on their face.

[Paul 584]

People choose to do various things that might not be the nicest thing in the world to do every day, doesnt make them a bad person in the same way that a life long rapist and pedo donating £500 to charity doesnt all of a sudden make him a good person.

 

 

Exactly! Not sure I have ever agreed with you more.

[etz 78]

A normal human being? Fallible? Capable of making poor decision? Marrying people because it seemed right at the time? Immoral has nothing to do with it, except to the person who's trust is broken. To suggest that people who cheat on their spouses before leaving them are being immoral is recklessly misguided. Like people leave their partners after having a nice chat with someone on the off chance they are going maybe fall deeper in love with them at some point in the future. The act of leaving them is the breaking of the trust not whether or not they've slept with someone else.

 

Rubbish, the trust is broken when you're dishonest emotionally or physically. If you want to screw around, have an open marriage and lay it out at the start.

 

 

So, you'd stay with someone you realised was not the person you wanted to be with because you'd previously told them you'd be with them forever, without any idea that there might actually be a better option out there? Buck up...

 

Nope, I'd be honest with them and break it off , and I certainly wouldn't be playing the field before I left them.

 

 

1. You have the empirical evidence that people who believe there are soulmates are more likely to cheat. Stop justifying your own nihilism with pretend facts.

 

Yup, article in September 1 issue of Social Science Research, by Bradford Wilcox, University of Virginia.

 

2. Again, in the real world you don't leave your partner if you've started to have feelings for someone else. If that was the case every marriage would end in divorce because temptation of one sort or another occurs for everyone. It's as ridiculous to suggest that someone who finds themselves falling in love with someone else that before any physical connection can be made they must leave their other partner as it is to suggest a woman should stay with a man who beats her because she promised to never leave him for better or worse. In the most base comparison do you go and buy a new car without even sitting in it?

 

If you're leaving someone for someone else, you're not going to end in a happy place. If your marriage is dead, you need to leave and spend some time being single before even thinking of finding someone else. Be happy being yourself and stop defining yourself as someone else's partner.

 

3. So you have never, not even once done something, done something because you wanted to? Yeah, pretty sure the newspaper is on your windows and the tinfoil on the door.

 

I've done plenty of things because I want to, but I don't do them when other people will get hurt. How the **** am I the one having to explain common decency to a normal person when it's an artificial construct to me?

 

Sweet, so paying someone to do something they may well not want to with someone they almost certainly do want to so it to is great and totally moral but leaving someone you don't love is the worst thing this side of murder? It's so good to know that all prostitutes are living their dream by having endless sex with strangers for money with a happy smile on their face.

 

Again, no problem with divorce if it's done honestly, just as I have no problem with prostitution if it's done properly (none of this slavery and human traffic bullshit).