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The day it died...


Murph
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Is there ONE specific moment when you just KNEW that the wrestling bubble had burst (around 00-03, or any other time).

 

When Angle-Benoit was announced for the Rumble '03, I just got pissed off and KNEW that wrestling wasn't what it used to be.

 

You?

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It wasn't really one stand out point for me, I don't think. I haven't watched wrestling non-stop for a very long time (Since I started watching, 1991-1994ish), and during the times when I wouldn't watch, I didn't really miss it, and the magic went.

 

Sometimes I still feel the way I did when I was growing up, and believed wrestling though. When you get a really big match, with near falls at the end, it's awesome, but that has happened very rarely in WWE recently. One of the main reason I like Triple H is, he is a realistic wrestler, who is one of the very few, who makes me 'mark out' big time.

 

I don't follow a lot of indies as much as I should, but I like the environment of the shows, and that relights the fire so to speak. I am primarily a RoH mark, and that is a company that entertains me in so many different ways, and, again, make sme feel like the fan I was 14 or so years ago. From high spot matches, with Jack Evans, Blade & Mikaze, or comedy with Cabana, Delirious (He needs to be on more shows), or straight up brilliant wrestling with 'American Dragon' Bryan Danielson, Christopher Daniels, Samoa Joe, Low Ki etc.

 

Without Ring of Honor, I doubt I would be a wrestling fan, like I am now. WWE and TNA don't entertain me on the whole, and other indies don't compare a lot of the time. RoH is the only company that regular makes me a happy fan.

 

So sometimes, the bubble has burst, in others not. It depends on the scenario largely.

 

(I am on the right track with this, no? I can't say I fully understood you either)

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When Mae Young gave birth to a hand, I had to admit to myself that the love-affair might be over...

 

Not just because of that awful moment, but also because it came at a time when I felt WWE were starting to lose sight of what was/wasn't cool, and what kind of things can/can't be considered entertainment.

 

They've never really recovered from that period either IMO, because they never re-discovered the formula that makes things cool and/or entertaining for the masses.

 

In fairness, I think WWE have hit-on something more palatable the last few weeks (partly as a result of fan reaction forcing Vince's hand regarding Cena, and a touch of hot-shotting) but as soon as the novelty of Edge wears off, and this year's Wrestlemania is in the past, the product will likely be bumbling along in frustratingly dead-end fashion as usual...

 

I mean, Raw used to be the best show on TV bar-none(!) but it's a LONG way from that kind of status right now-- and it was Mae Young giving birth to a hand that signalled the beginning of the end of the 'crossover appeal' era IMO...

Edited by Cartrouble kid
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Why was Kurt VS Benoit at RR 2003 a bad thing??? It turned out to be one of the matches of the year??? i think i missed something

 

I still love wrestling to this day... some things put that love under pressure sometimes (Cena as champ, Shelton Benjamins momma, some of the crap WWE booking) but the good thing is now i have TNA to turn to....

 

i found out it wasfake around january 2002.. fortunately i thought it was real during the alliance invasion (i started watching at Invasion) and that was awsome watching that storyline thinking the whole thing was real.... i actually thought the WWE was going to go out of buisness....( sometimesi wish it had:D)

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Sure the wrestling business has slowed down since the peaks of the "Attitude" era, but it hasn't burst, and I really don't think its ever possibe for it to burst.

 

When WCW was bought by the WWE I think that is a major contributing factor in the slow down of the business, but not the sole reason of the slow down.

 

Another reason is the lack of major wrestling mega stars, sure we have superstars in the likes of Cena & Edge etc, but no mega stars like The Rock or Steve Austin.

 

The slow down can be put down to so many different things, I think it would be impossible to identify the sole reason.

 

The WWE is working its way back up, and in my opinion the product has improved alot in the last 2 - 3 years. Also, hopefully companies like TNA Wrestling can help the industry, once they have established themselves.

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Wrestlemania 2000. The main event and the lack of Stone Cold coupled with a mediocre Wrestlemania made me think hmm, its starting to not be cool to like wrestling anymore again. To me that was pretty much when the Attitude period was no longer in top gear.

 

I think the point of the thread is at what moment did you say 'Hmm, wrestling isn't as popular/hot as it once was'.

 

How Angle v Benoit being booked as a title match at Royal Rumble made you think that however I have no idea. Wasn't it Match of the year 2003?? If anything that PPV made me think 'ah good, 2002 was AWFUL and now things might improve again'.

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Going by Simon's definition of the thread, the ending of the HHH-Angle-Stephanie love triangle was the killer for me. It's easy to see looking back how badly that storyline ended.

 

Triple H was treating his wife like crap. For years, she had harboured a secret crush on Kurt Angle, stemming back to his debut in the company. Kurt Angle made it clear he liked Stephanie too. But it went down the road of Angle being made to look like the creapy stalker, kissing Stephanie when she was unconscious. Triple H, a heel, was able to make all of these humours insults about Angle's character, making him look like a joke to the fans.

 

When it came to be that it finally looked like Stephanie was going to run to the man in her life who desperately wanted her, the storylined was killed off, HHH beat Angle in the ring and kissed Stephanie. It was never really mentioned again.

 

That's the moment where it became clear that the new generation of main eventer like HHH and Angle weren't going to be able to carry a company like Austin and Rock were able to. That's when it became clear the Attitude era was completely finished and WWE's hot streak was dead. I've heard of, and read, many witnesses who stated that this angle killed off any interest the female contingent of WWE's casual fans had in the company. They had the chance to create some new stars with a red hot storyline which appealed to both sexes. They blew it.

 

It would be easy enough to pin this disaster mostly on HHH, but I get the feeling if I did this thread would take a turn for the worse and become another generic Triple H debate.

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I'm with the majority in wanting to know more as to why Benoit/Angle at RR03 marked the end of good wrestlin' in the WWE.

 

Those two are the CREAM of the talent in the roster...both back then, and now.

So yeah - would the originator of the thread stand up and explain why this was so in his opinion...?!

 

And hey, I think that the bubble bursts and reforms reguarly...it just depends on whether or not you can accept the faults, and see if you like what comes down the line or not.

Wrestling's going nowhere, despite the WWE's efforts to shame themselves over and over - it just needs a moment sometimes to recover it's composure and remember how to entertain without compromising either the talent, or the audiences intelligence.

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I do agree with what Russ said, although I do feel maybe WWF's acquisition of both ECW and WCW is what really burst the bubble if the actual bubble was burst.

 

We had no more choices which could compete with the WWF and force them to raise their game. Therefore they've been allowed to become complacent and completely comfortable with their position.

 

Although on another note I kind of feel like my main expectations have matured,

I am not easily pleased or easily dissapointed.

You see if I just want to watch straight up athleticism and raw, paced, wrestling matches ROH is for me, if I just want to show my loyalty and maybe just MAYBE see one of my favourites alllowed to have an actual WRESTLING match in some crazy Soap Opera Angle I may tune into WWF(which hasn't been bloody likely since 2001), and if I want a cross between the two with a couple of familiar faces thrown in I'll tune into TNA. Basically I know what I want when I turn the T.V on and I know where to get it.

 

And HHH-Evolution has a point, things always go in cycles, there is always a lull before the pick up of pace and creativeness, and that goes for most things in life.

Edited by Thirteen
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The reason Angle-Benoit kilt it for me' date=' was because I had seen it so many times before, knew exactly what moves they were going to pull-off and when they would do it, and knew who was going to win. Do you find that exciting? Fine.[/quote']

 

 

If you've got the Royal Rumble 2003 DVD, I seriously suggest you watch that match again. Its one of the most exciting one on one WRESTLING matches Ive ever seen. These two world class athletes gave it their all, moves were countered, it was back and forth and you say that wrestling died for you that day??? :?

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The reason Angle-Benoit kilt it for me' date=' was because I had seen it so many times before, knew exactly what moves they were going to pull-off and when they would do it, and knew who was going to win. Do you find that exciting? Fine.[/quote']

 

Surley by that you mean Triple H vs Scott Steiner?

 

For me it changed with the Invasion angle. I actually enjoyed it, despite not knowing 90% of the WCW/ECW guys. After that was done, for me it went in a different direction. I haven't enjoyed wrestling as much as I did from that point on. I do wish I had got into it sooner, not just for WWE but ECW and WCW.

 

Not to say it's 'died' though. It's still very popular, TNA are a great alternative and the indy scenes pretty good. It's been a great start to the year, just look at the Rumble. Unpredictable, no one can predict a winner. What more do you want?

 

I still tune in every week, no matter what. And if it gets too bad there's always up to date TNA. :xyx

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