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Stolen Thread Idea: Maggie Thatcher, any good?


Paul
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We downsized the armed forces to save money that was then not spent on public services such as health and transport...

 

She cut money to education...

 

She caused a boom or bust structure in the economy that eventually DID go bust and lead to a massive ressision that took the country nearly a decade to recover from...

 

She almost killed the industrial sections of the economy and all of the mining by and large which has created poverty and desolation in areas that is still evident to this day...

 

Here handling of the peace process in Northern Ireland was woeful and cost many lives by proxy...

 

She was ugly...

 

The only good thing she ever did was prove that with or without US backing we would not back down from a threat and stand up to people stepping on our toes in the view of the Falklands War...

 

For which she then invented Poll Tax so we could foot the bill although surely with all the cut backs and 're-structuring' we went through we should have been rich enough?

 

So in closing... Maggie Thatcher... If the Argies hadn't invaded a few islands in '82 and the Labour party been crapper then dog poo stuck in the tread of your trainers... well you'd have been a much shorter and less damaging footnote on British history then you are now...

 

Plus she sired a criminal and arms running crook as well! And endorsed Pnochet's reign of terror in Chile too...

 

Bloody hell, why haven't we burned her at the stake already!

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I think she did a good job and was a strong leader. Given the decline of the country thanks to Labour in the seventies and having Britain led by the unions I think Britain is a better place now than it would have been without her.

 

Then again i'm a Tory so you'd expect me to say that. You probably also expect me to carry a picture of Maggie in my wallet, which of course I would but then it would block the picture of Hadrian's Wall :xyx

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I will give you that for a short period in the 1980's the country was fine and had been re-built from the strike ridden days of the Labour 1970's...

 

But she then slowly did the same and in place of skilled manufacturing workers and miners and such we where left with lots and LOTS of civil servants all over our public services and a generation bred to work in offices...

 

Thus we no longer have a well rounded economy and have to buy Coal from the sodding Poles despite our vast resourses of the stuff!

 

Fact is in 1982 she was gonna go if not for the war...

 

Then when it all went tits up after '87 and she could no longer ride that wave anymore the axe was dropped but the damage had been done.

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Although i'm not Maggies biggest fan. It was infact Michael Howard who came up with the Poll Tax.

 

She stood up to Arthur Scargill during the miners strikes, which is something that Tony Blair would be scared S*****ss of doing.

 

She also fought tooth and nail to win Britain a European rebate, which is one of the reasons that Britain has become a finacially secure and has a great rate of growth. Only to see Tony Blair do a good job of throwing away the rebate at the moment.

 

She made Britain proud again after a terrible 70's

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Shame she and her cabient caused the strikes and she passed through the idea of us entering the European common market that Major saw through with Lamont and once again killed off our economy for a while....

 

As a younger generation memeber I can only reflect on the bad moves she made (and she made a few) and not the positives which I agree there where a few...

 

But she wasn't the best thing for the country at all.... But she was at that time the lesser of two evils it has to be said.

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We downsized the armed forces to save money that was then not spent on public services such as health and transport...

 

She cut money to education...

 

She caused a boom or bust structure in the economy that eventually DID go bust and lead to a massive ressision that took the country nearly a decade to recover from...

 

She almost killed the industrial sections of the economy and all of the mining by and large which has created poverty and desolation in areas that is still evident to this day...

 

Here handling of the peace process in Northern Ireland was woeful and cost many lives by proxy...

 

She was ugly...

 

The only good thing she ever did was prove that with or without US backing we would not back down from a threat and stand up to people stepping on our toes in the view of the Falklands War...

 

For which she then invented Poll Tax so we could foot the bill although surely with all the cut backs and 're-structuring' we went through we should have been rich enough?

 

So in closing... Maggie Thatcher... If the Argies hadn't invaded a few islands in '82 and the Labour party been crapper then dog poo stuck in the tread of your trainers... well you'd have been a much shorter and less damaging footnote on British history then you are now...

 

Plus she sired a criminal and arms running crook as well! And endorsed Pnochet's reign of terror in Chile too...

 

Bloody hell, why haven't we burned her at the stake already!

 

I'm taking from your age that most of that vitriol was second hand information.

 

Your points:

 

We downsized the army: Yet we won the Falklands war (at a cost) and are considered the most rounded and best trained troops in the world, our special forces are reknowned for their elite profession. She also commissioned the Trident submarine, as well as new fleet ships.

 

She cut money to education: She took my milk from me, big deal! She disposed of corporal punishment and when I learned education was pretty damn good thank you very much!

 

She caused a boom or bust structure in the economy that eventually DID go bust and lead to a massive ressision that took the country nearly a decade to recover from: She invoked capitalism and privatisation, she took control of the bank of England's interest rates, which under labour meant that house prices were unobtainably high. She encouraged businesses to invest in towns and villages as their potential work forces. Black Tuesday as you referred to it was someone else's doing, not Thatcher's!

 

She almost killed the industrial sections of the economy and all of the mining by and large which has created poverty and desolation in areas that is still evident to this day: She took on powermongering unions which brought the end of John Callahagn after they striked and brought the country to a standstill, just remember in those days, if you weren't in the union you would have been beaten until you were. You have to face facts, coal and industry was dying anyway, we became a more prosperous country based on what Thatcher did.

 

Here handling of the peace process in Northern Ireland was woeful and cost many lives by proxy: What a load of B*lls, as someone who's family died by IRA bomb, there was no surrender during those times, we didn't give into terrorism then as we won't now, the IRA killed people not her! You should be ashamed of that comment! The woman was blown up herself and still held her resolve!

 

She was ugly: So are a lot of people in this world, what the hell has that got to do with anything?

 

For which she then invented Poll Tax so we could foot the bill although surely with all the cut backs and 're-structuring' we went through we should have been rich enough: So why did she negotiate this famous European rebate? Because we were poor from the Falklands war, we lost a lot of men and a lot of machines then. Britain was also STILL recovering from the second world war.

 

Her policy on a security law created Thatcham alarms.

 

She didn't go to war on Bush's say so.

 

She was the only Prime Minister to have the b*lls to say what she thought.

 

I liked her.

 

Saz

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Conparing to what is happening in Northern Ireland now and since the last attacks by Irish disidants on our people and to what happened in Thatchers time its strikes me there is one marked differance....

 

Less troops on the streets if at all now, less violence and no bombings since Omagh....

 

My uncle had his face blown off in a street bombing by the IRA in Northern Ireland in the 1980's. He was a Scottish Catholic doing his duty and was spat on by a child he shielded from the blast and called an English b**tard...

 

I know the pain what the IRA caused... Hell in 1995 if my bus hadn't have been late I would have been in a double decker bus right near the epicentre of the blast that tore Manchester apart....

 

But now there is a comparative peace and no more of these acts that scar our love ones...

 

And that was not achieved under Thatcher, hell they hated her so much they tried to blow her up!

 

Now that says something.

 

Now I'm not saying that everything now a days is great because it isn't.... But alot of problems that Major and the Conservative party inherited came from her and they caused further problems that we are still trying to recover from.

 

Hell Blair isn't helping that fact at all at the moment as well the way he follows Bush around (something I admit Maggie never did) but the fact is that quite a few problems that Labour sorted in the mid 90's came from Maggies time in power...

 

Shame they added a few of their own...

 

Plus Maggie didn't win the Falklands war.... The tactics of our leaders and the bravery of our troops did that, she just declared it over rocks we annexed due to the possibility of oil desposits in the region that she wished to exploit like others before her.

 

As for the Trident subs? What did they do for us? What do they do for us now except drain our finances? We didn't need them, the Polaris was enough as the USSR was crumbling before Maggie came to power due its own internal power struggles and the ill fated war in Afganistan....

 

However the Jump jet program and the VTOL carriers where her idea and I applaud them.

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And that was not achieved under Thatcher, hell they hated her so much they tried to blow her up!

 

They feared her because of her resolve, they tried to kill her so some other prime minister would capitulate.

 

Anyway in the words of Ben Elton:

 

"She was a battle axe but you can' help but admire her"

 

Saz

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They feared her because of her resolve, they tried to kill her so some other prime minister would capitulate.

 

Anyway in the words of Ben Elton:

 

"She was a battle axe but you can' help but admire her"

 

Saz

 

In some ways true but no PM since has capitualted to their demands, or that of the Nationists either...

 

IRA want the Ulster provience to join the rest of Ireland (hasn't happened) and the Nationalists what the IRA and similar organistations and political branches removed from office...

 

Seinn Fein etc...

 

Neither has happened and less people are dying, something that Thatcher wasn't able to bring to the table...

 

But to end this on my part....

 

She did a lot of sh**ty things for this country and alot of short term great things...

 

But like all leaders she left marks in the history of their country and not all of them where great in the long run...

 

But how many leaders can say they actually did long term good all the time for their nation?

 

But maybe because I come from a family with a mining and industry background and a staunch labour support it has clouded my eyes to everything she did...

 

Or on the other hand we all have bloody valid points and mine I shall not be completely swayed from.

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Not trying to sway you, life under Maggie was pretty damn good for me, so I am just pointing out that there is more than one perspective.

 

For example I see the miners as rioting troublemakers who did their best to disrupt the British economy and to a part they succeeded.

 

But that could be an unfair point of view, as could yours:)

 

Saz

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Ah well we are all entitled to our own opinions...

 

But the 1980's and Thatchers policies did not treat my family as kindly as yours or yourself so there is my view point.

 

Plus the Miners where fighting for better rights, shame people who represented them where bent as a nine bob note and sold them out in the end...

 

And in other industries and areas it is happening with Blair and the Labour party now...

 

Politics and history just go round in circles, no doubt in ten years we will be asking if Blair was a good or crap leader as well....

 

And once again it will be a split pot... although Maggie and the Conservatives actually had a reason to fight Iraq...

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She did some good and some bad.

 

While she was the strongest leader that the UK has had in decades, she made some horrible mistakes which screwed up the country, like selling off some of the nation's companies.

 

All of the time that she was messing up certain aspects, she was doing wonders in others, so her time was "balanced".

 

 

I think the problem is that you have to compare her to the PMs that have followed - Major was a "nobody", while Blair is so far up the President's butt that it's embarrasing.

 

So, yes, she was good compared to the others, but she didn't do all good for the country.

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Coming from a part of the country that stupid woman nearly destroyed with her move out of industrial labour into cushty office jobs I'd say I hate her, so many people lost their jobs because of her, most of the men working round here were involved in coal mining or fishing, she ****ed up both, brought in new laws that other countries were allowed to fish in our waters but we were only allowed to catch a certain amount. 90% of my family lost their jobs because of that stupid cow, I wished she'd rot in hell, she's the reason I hate politicians cos she was the first one I ever knew anything about and well not a very good standing to start off on.

 

She came to my town to drum up support for her party yeah right that worked like a lead balloon, she came to my school and we all had to line up to shake her hand, I stood there in line waiting wondering if I'd get chance to say anything, she'd stop at every few children and talk to them so I hoped she would stop at me and she did, she put her hand out for me to shake it and I refused my teacher tried forcing me, I stood firm and said "You have ruined this town and you want us all to be nice, I would bite your hand but it aint feeding enough to bite from it anyway. No-one wants you here its all just niceties now **** off."

 

I got suspended from school but my parents were proud of me, I stood up to the Iron Woman at about 11 I think I'm not exactly sure how old I was. Not long after that she resigned from office I know that much because there was a big party in our street and we burned models of her it was great.

 

Although I was not directly effected by the mining closures and the fishing laws it was still horrible to watch my family have to struggle and save just to provide for for their kids because she'd naffed things up. Ok so mining wasnt a desirable job but the men round here done it well and they got paid well, it still angers some of them that we now ship in coal from other parts of the world, whats wrong with our stuff it burns the same.

 

She ruined Britain as a whole and as for her standing up for what she believed in well if any one of your girlfriends done that you'd just call her annoying and stubborn and be wound up with her about it.

 

xXx

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Coming from a part of the country that stupid woman nearly destroyed with her move out of industrial labour into cushty office jobs I'd say I hate her, so many people lost their jobs because of her, most of the men working round here were involved in coal mining or fishing, she ****ed up both, brought in new laws that other countries were allowed to fish in our waters but we were only allowed to catch a certain amount. 90% of my family lost their jobs because of that stupid cow, I wished she'd rot in hell, she's the reason I hate politicians cos she was the first one I ever knew anything about and well not a very good standing to start off on.

 

She came to my town to drum up support for her party yeah right that worked like a lead balloon, she came to my school and we all had to line up to shake her hand, I stood there in line waiting wondering if I'd get chance to say anything, she'd stop at every few children and talk to them so I hoped she would stop at me and she did, she put her hand out for me to shake it and I refused my teacher tried forcing me, I stood firm and said "You have ruined this town and you want us all to be nice, I would bite your hand but it aint feeding enough to bite from it anyway. No-one wants you here its all just niceties now **** off."

 

I got suspended from school but my parents were proud of me, I stood up to the Iron Woman at about 11 I think I'm not exactly sure how old I was. Not long after that she resigned from office I know that much because there was a big party in our street and we burned models of her it was great.

 

Although I was not directly effected by the mining closures and the fishing laws it was still horrible to watch my family have to struggle and save just to provide for for their kids because she'd naffed things up. Ok so mining wasnt a desirable job but the men round here done it well and they got paid well, it still angers some of them that we now ship in coal from other parts of the world, whats wrong with our stuff it burns the same.

 

She ruined Britain as a whole and as for her standing up for what she believed in well if any one of your girlfriends done that you'd just call her annoying and stubborn and be wound up with her about it.

 

xXx

You forgot to mention that you also kicked her in the stomach and lifted her over your head with one arm and threw her to the floor, and then spat on her and rallied all the people around you to chant for her impeachment before you Shining Wizarded her in the head, and got lifted in the air by everyone who cheered your name and took your picture which still remains in the office of a very important person in your village. Didn't you also stop communism?

 

 

I like Thatcher. Well no, tell a lie, I like Spitting Images version of her. I miss that show.

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I can't stand Thatcher' date=' two words. POLL TAX. She used Scotland as a guinea pig for a costly experiment. I have to admit I do admire her for standing by her convictions, but her convictions largly sucked.[/quote']

 

I dont see the big problem with Poll Tax..

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Thatcher, and this is a true fact, I know, I saw it on the internet, single handidly made friend with each and every miner, buying them each their own VCR, this meant over time the amount of strikes were dramatically decreased, but everyone had a VCR.

 

THIS IS A FACT PEOPLE.

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I dont see the big problem with Poll Tax..

If you lived in Scotland you would have. It was way too much to the point that there were Protests in the street. I think Tommy Sheridan that is or was the leader of the Scottish Socialist Party actually went to jail a few times for non payment in protest of it being thrust upon is by Thatcher.

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I think Tommy Sheridan that is or was the leader of the Scottish Socialist Party actually went to jail a few times for non payment in protest of it being thrust upon is by Thatcher.

 

Tommy Sheirdan lives just around the corner from me. To be fair, Tommy Sheridan seems to go to jail once a month on average for something he believes in :)

 

as for Thatcher? I'm sorry, I don't do politics...

 

http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/9199/do1ru.jpg

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You know, something just struck me as odd. In the day and age of "looking the part" counts as much as your actual policies, pretty much ushered in with the Blair era, even slightly before, you have to wonder if Thatcher would be electable. Or if she would have even got the party nomination. I don't know why this struct me as odd or interesting, but thinking back over the past elections it's always been about the leaders looks as well as their abilities.

 

I think it has to do with living in the day and age where satire has incredible impact, the worse looking a candidate is, the easier it is to make the cheap jokes about them, which you may think is funny at first, but it means they do lose a hell of a lot of their credibility in the voters eyes. I know there has been things like Spitting Image and such in this past, but it does seem with the advancement in society, if Thatcher would get her party nomination in this day is a very interesting question.

 

No idea why this struck me.

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