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is it just me....


Fletch
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Or DAMN is it good to see Kevin Nash back wrestling or at least on tv ready to wrestle in a couple weeks. i honestly dont care what anyone says about Nash he can still cut it and I personally have liked Nash for a while.

 

Coming out to Dr Dre does him heaps of favours in my good books too

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Or DAMN is it good to see Kevin Nash back wrestling or at least on tv ready to wrestle in a couple weeks. i honestly dont care what anyone says about Nash he can still cut it and I personally have liked Nash for a while.

 

Coming out to Dr Dre does him heaps of favours in my good books too

 

I think it's great. I've never disliked Nash or had anything against him. It's not that I didn't like it, but to me he just didn't seem right at the top. I certainly appreciated him though.

 

What's this about Dr.Dre music for Nash???

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If I could be bothered I could name a lot more than half a dozen.

 

No, he is no Chris Benoit but at 7 feet tall he's not going to be. He has at times in his career been hugely entertaining. His mic work has always been good, and he has when he wants to a really good presence in the ring.

 

I'm not trying to make out he's some sort of legendary icon or something, but he was/is better than most people give him credit for.

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You have your opinion on it, it's undoubtedly not the popular one with most fans, although on these sorts of boards you'll find lots of people agreeing wtih you I expect.

 

Nash bought a charisma, and ring presence with him that in his WWF stint first time round, and in WCW 1996-1999 made him an excellent guy to have around. He entertained the hell out of me.

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To be honest it's the same in any US promotion. Even the indies it's almost always the guys that have a bit of personality and some sort of character who get over while the generic guys that wrestle good matches don't. ROH is perhaps an exception but there nobody really stands out. It never really seems to matter who wins a match, just what the quality of the match is like so in the end nothing ever seems to build up. The difference with that promotion is that nobody is ever going to get over based on what they do there. Nobody stands out, nobody's going to make a name for themself whether the matches are good or not.

 

If you have a decent look, can talk well, and have a decent ammount of ring presence you'll most likely end up in the WWE, which basically means you've reached the top of the US industry.

Edited by Jayden
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Mind you in even in WWE the most 80% or more of these people regardless of chrasmia or looks will do is go nowhere (Thats only because there can obviously only be so many main eventers.) sure they might get an IC / US run or something but thats about it. Look at Test he's the perfect example of how even the right looks mean nothing if you can't put on a good match

 

Looks, & mic skill mean you have a better chance of geting to the top though.

Edited by The Icon
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I even find people like Heidenreich & Snitsky more exiting they have done more to make me like them in a few months than Nash has in the last 14 years that I have being watching him.

There is no way Gene Shitsky is more entertaining than Kevin Nash. Sure Nash has made his mistakes but he is better than that now. Nash is great on the mic and can still put on decent matches (if he doesn't get hurt).

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ROH is perhaps an exception but there nobody really stands out.

 

Have you actually seen any recent RoH shows from the last 2 years because by the sounds if it you clearly haven't, or can you actually give examples of from the last 2 years of RoH were the above has been the case? because its sounds just as retarded as Simons "young boys jumping around in the ring" argument.

 

Nobody really stands out?, so I guess CM Punk, Samoa Joe, American Dragon, Homicide, Low-Ki, Steve Corino, guys before like AJ Styles, Paul London and Chris Daniels and even guys like Jim Cornette or Mick Foley are a bunch of boring guys with no character or charisma. There’s a reason why those guys mentioned are the top stars of RoH and Chad Colyer, Tom Carter or Matt Stryker aren't and its because they can get characters over and stand out.

 

 

It never really seems to matter who wins a match' date=' just what the quality of the match is like so in the end nothing ever seems to build up.[/quote']

 

The classic words of someone who has never seen the product, two big examples of how wrong that statement is, Homicide/Corino and Raven/CM Punk feuds from last year. Both feuds were regarded as the MVPs of RoH and Indy wrestling by most people who saw them but both got over not because of match quality but by the intensity they generated and the promos and angles that carried them.

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Tajiri get off your high horse and stop attacking me. You missed my point.

There’s a reason why those guys mentioned are the top stars of RoH
they are the top stars of ROH, and where else are they the top stars of? My point is nobody will make their name in ROH. They may become one of the bigger stars in ROH, but as it's such a niche market that they play to that won't mean a thing throughout the rest of the US.

CM Punk, Samoa Joe, American Dragon, Homicide, Low-Ki, Steve Corino, guys before like AJ Styles, Paul London and Chris Daniels and even guys like Jim Cornette or Mick Foley
foley and cornette did not make their nanes in ROH, they did that before they were there and if anything simply being in ROH actually dents their name value rather than enhances it. CM Punk, Samoa Joe, American Dragon, Homicide, the average guy on the street in the US is going to know who those guys are is he? They are stars in ROH, but they are not stars outside of it. Low Ki is good, but has done as much good work in Japan and TNA to get himself recognised as he has in ROH. Steve Corino made his name in ECW before going there. Styles made his name in TNA, if he really has made a name for himself at all, which I still doubt to be honest. Chris Daniels again, made his name in Japan, and perhaps TNA, and various indies. Hardly a ROH product either. Paul London did well enough in the indies, places like ROH and TNA to get snapped up by the WWE and the opportunity to make a name for himself there.

 

You've completely missed my point in your blinkered defence of ROH. If you think it should appeal to all fans then you couldn't be more wrong. If it offends you that it doesn't appeal to me then that's ridiculous. And if by listing the names of the guys you did you genuinely think you've proved that people in ROH are standing out and making themselves famous then that's equally ridiculous.

 

I like TNA, but can sit here and criticise it when I think it's doing something wrong, which very often it does. ROH plays to a niche market of hardcore ROH fans and will never be anything more. Now, that's fine, but don't try and pretend it's something it's not and that it's creating new stars all over the place when the reality is it hasn't made one.

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No but then I didn't say that anyone was making a name for themselves in TNA either did I? I mean, I even just admitted that I don't really believe AJ has made much of a name for himself with his work in TNA, not really. I mean, wrestling fans know who he is but who the hell else does? And I still think there are a lot of WWE fans who wouldn't have a clue who he was if he turned up on Smackdown unannounced one week.

 

All TNA has done is created stars for their own fans. AMW, Styles, Monty, Abyss, Killings, these guys are really over with TNA audiences. And the guys Tajiri mentioned are really over with ROH audiences. But outside of that who knows who they are and really gives a crap what they are doing tomorrow?

Edited by Jayden
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they are the top stars of ROH, and where else are they the top stars of? My point is nobody will make their name in ROH. They may become one of the bigger stars in ROH, but as it's such a niche market that they play to that won't mean a thing throughout the rest of the US.

foley and cornette did not make their nanes in ROH, they did that before they were there and if anything simply being in ROH actually dents their name value rather than enhances it. CM Punk, Samoa Joe, American Dragon, Homicide, the average guy on the street in the US is going to know who those guys are is he? They are stars in ROH, but they are not stars outside of it. Low Ki is good, but has done as much good work in Japan and TNA to get himself recognised as he has in ROH. Steve Corino made his name in ECW before going there. Styles made his name in TNA, if he really has made a name for himself at all, which I still doubt to be honest. Chris Daniels again, made his name in Japan, and perhaps TNA, and various indies. Hardly a ROH product either. Paul London did well enough in the indies, places like ROH and TNA to get snapped up by the WWE and the opportunity to make a name for himself there.

 

You've completely missed my point in your blinkered defence of ROH. If you think it should appeal to all fans then you couldn't be more wrong. If it offends you that it doesn't appeal to me then that's ridiculous. And if by listing the names of the guys you did you genuinely think you've proved that people in ROH are standing out and making themselves famous then that's equally ridiculous.

 

I like TNA, but can sit here and criticise it when I think it's doing something wrong, which very often it does. ROH plays to a niche market of hardcore ROH fans and will never be anything more. Now, that's fine, but don't try and pretend it's something it's not and that it's creating new stars all over the place when the reality is it hasn't made one.

 

I see your point now about creating stars for a more mainstream scale of people and would agree that nobody outside of WWE can do that, I was talking about within the US indy scence which RoH holds alot more weight mainly because the whole market has geared itself towards that same fanbase and away from the average WWE viewer like it once was, however your still way of the mark if you belive nothing "builds up" within the RoH.

Edited by Tajiri
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no, and I understand that ROH holds a lot of weight on the indie scene. It's a much talked about promotion for inside wrestling fans. But as with any indie, and I'd include TNA in that, outside of that who knows who they are?

 

Perhaps me saying nothing builds up was a bit over the top as my viewing of ROH has been more about watching individual shows, than watching back to back ones over a period of time. what I've seen when I have though is lots of very good matches, which I struggle to care about. Maybe that's because I only watch it now and then, or maybe it's just because the style of promotion isn't what I personally enjoy.

 

I'd say to be honest it's probably the latter, but that's just me as a fan. I like the big lights, the over the top characters, the ridiculous storylines. Call me a mark or whatever but that's just me. Yes I love watching four awesome X Division guys doing something special in some sort of crazy match but I also like to see a bit of razmataz and well created television.

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